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* Toyota says no evidence 'runaway' Prius happened - 19 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.autos.makers.honda/t/8c002a7a54dcca97?hl=en
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TOPIC: Toyota says no evidence 'runaway' Prius happened
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.autos.makers.honda/t/8c002a7a54dcca97?hl=en
==============================================================================
== 1 of 19 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 17 2010 8:54 pm
From: Scott in Florida
On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:09:09 -0400, "C. E. White"
<cewhite3remove@mindspring.com> wrote:
>My interns are all female Swedish models and they were out getting some sun
>yesterday.
>
>Ed
Pictures at 11?????
--
Scott in Florida
== 2 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 4:41 am
From: "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
In article <Xns9D3EE7146C773tegger@208.90.168.18>,
Tegger <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote:
> I gather the Prius is set up so that it mimics a conventional car's
> automatic transmission "creep" when at a standstill and in Drive.
The Prius is set up to behave just like every other car you've ever
driven. No surprises here, no retraining. It creeps while "in gear",
and the braking system (at least on my 07) behaves astoundingly
perfectly given what's going on under the hood.
Toyota really did a masterful job making the black magic behave like
everyone expects a car to behave.
== 3 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 3:44 am
From: dr_jeff
ACAR wrote:
> On Mar 16, 8:00 pm, dr_jeff <u...@msu.edu> wrote:
> wreckless endangerment.
>
> well, he didn't wreck...
Sorry, I did a Mike Hunter.
== 4 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 3:47 am
From: dr_jeff
Obveeus wrote:
> "AZ Nomad" <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:00:41 -0400, dr_jeff <utz@msu.edu> wrote:
>>> Cameo wrote:
>>>> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
>>>> news:Xns9D3DC4DEA22B6tegger@208.90.168.18...
>>>>> Or when you rip along at 90mph while rapidly alternating between gas
>>>>> pedal
>>>>> and brake pedal, which is what this Sikes fellow did.
>>>> I wonder if that can be proven with enough confidence to sue the guy
>>>> criminally. It would be no point to do that in civil court as he is a
>>>> deadbeat.
>>> First, we don't know if he did anything wrong. Innocent until proven
>>> guilty.
>>> Second, if he is guilty, there could charges of speeding, lying to
>>> police and wreckless endangerment.
>
> Charges for speeding and lying to police should be forthcoming. I'm not
> sure what the laws in California are with respect to how much over the
> posted speed limit a driver has to go before it becomes 'wreckless
> endangerment'. Still, the police probably just want to see this incident
> fade away from the front pages as quickly as possible given how they were
> duped.
The actions of the police kept the driver more in check than if they
didn't show up. They acted appropriately.
And, if it turns out that he was lying, a new pair of bracelets would be
appropriate, too. I think they definitely have him on reckless
endangerment (again, so I did a Mike Hunter with the spelling) because
he endangered the lives of some many people, particularly the life of a
CHP officer.
>> perhaps some jail if he has done shit like this before as the wendy's
>> finger-fraud lady did.
>
> Apparently, he has twice filed insurance claims when short of funds. Those
> insurance claims probably need another look given recent events.
True.
== 5 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 3:49 am
From: dr_jeff
Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>
>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is charged
>>> but the car is still under battery power and if left on and in drive it
>>> will walk away from you
>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>
> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how every
> other car works.
>
> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite admirably,
> frankly. They did a stupendous job.
Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
== 6 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 6:14 am
From: "C. E. White"
"Scott in Florida" <MoveOn@Outa.here> wrote in message
news:2v83q5t6t2s13tqb7062b5f1b259ei66gr@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:09:09 -0400, "C. E. White"
> <cewhite3remove@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>My interns are all female Swedish models and they were out getting
>>some sun
>>yesterday.
>>
>>Ed
>
> Pictures at 11?????
jim bean is already jealous of my brilliant mind, great looks, and
fabulous wealth. Posting pictures of my interns might send him oer the
edge into a deep depression, so I'll spare jim and the group.
Ed
== 7 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 7:17 am
From: Scott in Florida
On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 09:14:19 -0400, "C. E. White" <cewhite3@mindspring.com>
wrote:
>
>"Scott in Florida" <MoveOn@Outa.here> wrote in message
>news:2v83q5t6t2s13tqb7062b5f1b259ei66gr@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:09:09 -0400, "C. E. White"
>> <cewhite3remove@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>My interns are all female Swedish models and they were out getting
>>>some sun
>>>yesterday.
>>>
>>>Ed
>>
>> Pictures at 11?????
>
>jim bean is already jealous of my brilliant mind, great looks, and
>fabulous wealth. Posting pictures of my interns might send him oer the
>edge into a deep depression, so I'll spare jim and the group.
>
>Ed
>
My email box is open....
I'm not like the others, I won't share the pics with the world...
LOL
--
Scott in Florida
== 8 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 9:18 am
From: Nasty
dr_jeff wrote:
> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>
>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on and
>>>> in drive it will walk away from you
>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>
>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>> every other car works.
>>
>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
>> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>
> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
== 9 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 9:42 am
From: Tegger
Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba25260$0$4884
$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> dr_jeff wrote:
>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>>> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on and
>>>>> in drive it will walk away from you
>>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>>
>>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>>> every other car works.
>>>
>>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
>>> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>>
>> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
>
> What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
He must mean that he has a manual transmission.
It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an "automatic" to
its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would expect the Prius to
behave like a traditional automatic-transmission ICE car, and that Toyota
would design the Prius to behave as such.
--
Tegger
== 10 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 10:07 am
From: Nasty
Tegger wrote:
> Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba25260$0$4884
> $9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
>> dr_jeff wrote:
>>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>>>> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on and
>>>>>> in drive it will walk away from you
>>>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>>>> every other car works.
>>>>
>>>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
>>>> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>>>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>>> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
>> What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
>
>
>
> He must mean that he has a manual transmission.
<sigh>
>
> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an "automatic" to
> its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would expect the Prius to
> behave like a traditional automatic-transmission ICE car, and that Toyota
> would design the Prius to behave as such.
>
>
Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there is
no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to the
VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such a
crappy little box. But, my wife consistently gets in the low 50's.
== 11 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 10:21 am
From: "C. E. White"
"Nasty" <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com...
> It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such
> a crappy little box.
Comapred to what? I don't own one, but I have been in them. It's no
BMW, but for the price it is an incredible deal. I find it as
comfortable as a Camry (not that Camry's are world class in comfort).
The only significant negatives I am aware of are the narrow width and
the horrible view out the rear. It is not really my cup of tea, but I
don't think I'd call it a "crappy little box."
Ed
== 12 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 11:13 am
From: Tegger
Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in
news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> Tegger wrote:
>>
>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an
>> "automatic" to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would
>> expect the Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission
>> ICE car, and that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>
>>
>
> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there
> is no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to
> the VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
Do you need to shift into 2nd manually, or is it more like a CVT?
--
Tegger
== 13 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 12:14 pm
From: Nasty
Tegger wrote:
> Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in
> news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>
>>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an
>>> "automatic" to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would
>>> expect the Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission
>>> ICE car, and that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>>
>>>
>> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
>> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
>> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there
>> is no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to
>> the VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
>
>
>
> Do you need to shift into 2nd manually, or is it more like a CVT?
>
>
>
>
CVT.
== 14 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 12:22 pm
From: Nasty
C. E. White wrote:
> "Nasty" <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>
>> It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such
>> a crappy little box.
>
> Comapred to what? I don't own one, but I have been in them. It's no
> BMW, but for the price it is an incredible deal. I find it as
> comfortable as a Camry (not that Camry's are world class in comfort).
> The only significant negatives I am aware of are the narrow width and
> the horrible view out the rear. It is not really my cup of tea, but I
> don't think I'd call it a "crappy little box."
>
> Ed
>
>
I do own one, as I've previously stated. Bought it new in '07. The more
you ride in one the more you see and feel. I think it has a bad ride,
uncomfortable seats, weird and rubbery steering, it wallows around turns
and there's a lot of wind noise at highway speed. It feels cheap and
boxy to me. It's a technological marvel but it is, IMHO, far inferior to
a Camry.
== 15 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 4:29 pm
From: Tegger
Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba27b9a$0$4959
$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
> Tegger wrote:
>> Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in
>> news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>>
>>> Tegger wrote:
>>
>>>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an
>>>> "automatic" to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would
>>>> expect the Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission
>>>> ICE car, and that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
>>> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
>>> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there
>>> is no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to
>>> the VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you need to shift into 2nd manually, or is it more like a CVT?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> CVT.
>
So... it is, then, for all intents and purposes, an automatic.
Since some 90% of new cars in North America are purchased with automatics,
Toyota had chosen well in having the Prius mimic a traditional automatic.
--
Tegger
== 16 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 4:47 pm
From: Tegger
Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba27d83$0$4986
$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>
> I do own one, as I've previously stated. Bought it new in '07. The more
> you ride in one the more you see and feel. I think it has a bad ride,
> uncomfortable seats, weird and rubbery steering, it wallows around turns
> and there's a lot of wind noise at highway speed. It feels cheap and
> boxy to me. It's a technological marvel but it is, IMHO, far inferior to
> a Camry.
>
Toyota makes little to no money on the Prius; it's an "image" car, and is
expensive to build. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that they've
cut a /lot/ of corners in an attempt to keep the line from being a major
money pit.
--
Tegger
== 17 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 6:01 pm
From: dr_jeff
Nasty wrote:
> dr_jeff wrote:
>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>>> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on and
>>>>> in drive it will walk away from you
>>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>>
>>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>>> every other car works.
>>>
>>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just like
>>> every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>>
>> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
>
> What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
A manual transmission.
== 18 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 6:02 pm
From: dr_jeff
Nasty wrote:
> Tegger wrote:
>> Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in news:4ba25260$0$4884
>> $9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>>
>>> dr_jeff wrote:
>>>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>>>> In article <slrnhq03dm.9n8.aznomad.3@ip70-176-155-130.ph.ph.cox.net>,
>>>>> AZ Nomad <aznomad.3@PremoveOBthisOX.COM> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> The gas motor may not be running when stopped if the battery is
>>>>>>> charged but the car is still under battery power and if left on
>>>>>>> and in drive it will walk away from you
>>>>>> Do you have some insane notion that electric motors idle?
>>>>> If left on and in drive, it will move away from you--just like how
>>>>> every other car works.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is this confusing to you? Toyota designed the Prius to ACT just
>>>>> like every other car everyone has ever driven. It does that quite
>>>>> admirably, frankly. They did a stupendous job.
>>>> Not my car. It doesn't have a "drive."
>>> What does it have <he asked half knowing he would sigh at the answer>?
>>
>>
>>
>> He must mean that he has a manual transmission.
>
> <sigh>
>
>>
>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an "automatic"
>> to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would expect the
>> Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission ICE car, and
>> that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>
>>
>
> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there is
> no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to the
> VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
>
> It's really an ingenious piece of engineering. Too bad it's in such a
> crappy little box. But, my wife consistently gets in the low 50's.
My dad's Ford Five Hundred has a CVT. The controls are marked like those
of an automatic, with P, R, N, D and either low or 1.
Jeff
== 19 of 19 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 18 2010 6:03 pm
From: dr_jeff
Nasty wrote:
> Tegger wrote:
>> Nasty <nasty@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in
>> news:4ba25dd9$0$4868$9a6e19ea@unlimited.newshosting.com:
>>> Tegger wrote:
>>
>>>> It's obvious to me that the Prius would be perceived as an
>>>> "automatic" to its drivers. It therefore follows that drivers would
>>>> expect the Prius to behave like a traditional automatic-transmission
>>>> ICE car, and that Toyota would design the Prius to behave as such.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Interesting point. Even though the gear selector is marked like a
>>> traditional automatic, "P", "N", "D", etc., and there is no clutch
>>> pedal, it really does kind of act somewhat like a manual since there
>>> is no automatic shifting from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Sorta harkens back to
>>> the VW "automatic/manual" tranny.
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you need to shift into 2nd manually, or is it more like a CVT?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> CVT.
Actually, it is a type of CVT.
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