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* U.S. study finds driver error in most Toyota accidents - 19 messages, 12
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http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos/t/f770c7e0910be307?hl=en
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TOPIC: U.S. study finds driver error in most Toyota accidents
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos/t/f770c7e0910be307?hl=en
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== 1 of 19 ==
Date: Tues, Aug 10 2010 9:03 pm
From: jim beam
On 08/10/2010 08:44 PM, C. E. White wrote:
<snip masquerade>
you're a detroit shill "farmer" ed. trying to "blend in" by posting
something we already knew doesn't work.
--
nomina rutrum rutrum
== 2 of 19 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 11 2010 4:44 am
From: "hls"
"C. E. White" <cewhite3remove@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:mt-dnThtVN8zgf_RnZ2dnUVZ_h-dnZ2d@earthlink.com...
> U.S. study finds driver error in most Toyota accidents
Isnt that what was found in the Audi cases some years ago? AFAIK,
they never found a failure in the systems in those cases.
== 3 of 19 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 11 2010 6:46 am
From: Harry K
On Aug 10, 8:44 pm, "C. E. White" <cewhite3rem...@mindspring.com>
wrote:
> U.S. study finds driver error in most Toyota accidents
> Automaker acknowledges other research, independent corroboration is needed
> Staff and wire reports August 10, 2010 - 4:01 pm ET
> UPDATED: 8/10/10 6:56 p.m. ET
>
> WASHINGTON -- Brakes weren't applied by drivers of Toyota vehicles in at
> least 35 of 58 crashes blamed on unintended acceleration, U.S. auto-safety
> regulators said after studying data recorders.
>
> The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration also saw no evidence of
> electronics-related causes for the accidents in reviewing the vehicle
> recorders, known as black boxes, the agency said today in a report to
> lawmakers.
>
> The preliminary findings bolster Toyota's contentions that there's no
> evidence of flaws in electronic controls on its vehicles and that motorists
> in some cases confused the accelerator and brake pedals.
>
> But Toyota spokesman Brian Lyons acknowledged this evening that the
> company's black boxes have limited capability because they typically produce
> data only when the airbag is activated.
>
> "The data should also be independently corroborated, e.g., through physical
> evidence, other research, etc." he said in an e-mail to Automotive News.
>
> Toyota's black boxes are built into the airbag sensor and usually begin
> recording only when the airbag is deployed, Lyons said.
>
> Since November, Toyota has recalled 9.4 million vehicles worldwide,
> including 7.5 million in the U.S., for acceleration problems involving floor
> mats and sticky pedals, Lyons said.
>
> "At this early point in its investigation, NHTSA officials have drawn no
> conclusions about additional causes of unintended acceleration in Toyotas
> beyond the two defects already known -- pedal entrapment and sticking gas
> pedals," the agency said in the report provided for a briefing to lawmakers
> in Washington.
>
> In addition to the 60 percent of cases where brakes weren't used, NHTSA
> cited accidents in which the brakes were applied partially or the data
> recorder failed.
>
> Toyota has conducted more than 4,000 on-site vehicle inspections, and said
> today it has not found electronic throttle controls to be a cause of
> unintended acceleration.
>
> "Toyota's own vehicle evaluations have confirmed that the remedies it
> developed for sticking accelerator pedal and potential accelerator pedal
> entrapment by an unsecured or incompatible floor mat are effective," the
> company said.
>
> "We have also confirmed several different causes for unintended acceleration
> reports, including pedal entrapment by floor mats, pedal misapplication and
> vehicle functions where a slight increase in engine speed is normal, such as
> engine idle up from a cold start or air conditioning loads."
>
> In many cases studied by federal regulators, the driver made an allegation
> of unintended acceleration.
>
> Questions about data
>
> NHTSA said its study was limited to post 2007 vehicles because most Toyota
> models made before 2007 did not have black boxes that stored pre-crash data.
>
> Most sudden acceleration complaints since 1999 occurred before 2007,
> according to a February study by Safety Research & Strategies, a research
> and advocacy firm funded in part by plaintiff lawyers.
>
> A high proportion of these involved 2002-2006 Camrys and 2005-2006 Tacoma
> pick-up trucks, the study found.
>
> "The idea that Toyota has been exonerated is preposterous given all the
> facts," said Sean Kane, the firm's president. "This is a small sampling of
> crashes."
>
> Kane added that the vast majority of sudden acceleration incidents are at
> too low a speed to activate the black boxes. The NHTSA study is thus limited
> to an examination of high-speed crashes, he said.
>
> In addition, Toyota itself has said in court that the scientific accuracy of
> its black boxes has never been validated, calling into question the validity
> of their data, Kane said.
>
> Limited braking
>
> Of the 58 recording devices analyzed, 35 showed that at the moment of the
> crash impact, the driver hadn't depressed the brake pedal at all, safety
> officials said. Fourteen more cases showed partial braking. In another nine
> cases, the brake had been depressed at the "last second" before impact.
>
> The government's preliminary examination also said there were a handful of
> other crashes where the brake was pressed early and released, or in which
> the brake and gas pedals were pressed at the same time. There was one case
> of pedal entrapment by a floor mat.
>
> In five cases, NHTSA said, the electronic recording device failed to work
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